近日，上海英语剧团SRT剧社(Shanghai Repertory Theater)推出的莎士比亚名剧《第十二夜》（Twelfth Night）在上海上演。沪江网有幸请到该剧导演，研究莎士比亚戏剧长达45年之久的Thomas Caron先生做客沪江，和我们一起聊一聊这次上演的《第十二夜》，以及他钟爱的莎士比亚。

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1. what brought you to Shanghai to do this?

你是怎么想到来上海做莎士比亚戏剧的？

I've been coming in China for a few years for personal reasons. On my very first day, I knew this is where I wanted to live. So I arranged first teaching, in Pudong. And I did that for a year. Then I eventually moved to Puxi, and teaching drama to children in an association with Shanghai theater academy, that's my principal employment. I'm also working with the English Repertory Theater, company theater, there's two.

Because I thought my acting life is over when I came to China. But it's been just the opposite. I've been performing a lot. Some of the great great plays, had some opportunities to direct. This is the right decision for me.

几年前我因为一些个人原因来到了中国，而我到上海的第一天就知道这是我想生活的城市。我最初在上海找了一份教师的工作，跟着开始教小朋友们戏剧，也为现在的剧团工作。我刚来中国时，以为自己从此和表演绝缘了。不过事实恰好相反，我有很多演出机会，有的是非常非常棒的剧目，当然也做导演。我想我来中国是一个正确的决定。

2. What is your motivation to not only bring Shakespeare to Shanghai, but also do a Chinese version?

是怎么想到不仅要做《第十二夜》的英文版、还要做中文版的？

Well, I didn't choose to do it. This is the theater company, the producer choose to do this play, and she asked me to direct it. I've been involved with productions in Twelfth Night, this is my fifth production, as a producer or an actor. If I was been to choose my own play to do it, I probably choose something else. But this is a very, very popular play. It's good if you want to sale tickets to make money, cause people want to see this play. And I've directed before, I've directed seven years ago, in Massachusetts. So I'm very familiar with it. My goal in coming to China is to work with Chinese actors in Chinese. I didn't want to rush it. I wanted to just let things develop. And I always thought that when I came to the point where I'm ready to direct the Chinese actors in a Chinese Shakespeare play, this would be the play I would do. Because I was familiar with it; because it has a relatively small number of people in it; and it's a very popular play! So by coincidence when I was asked to direct this play in English, I thought now it's the time to do it in Chinese. Because I've built the set, I got all the props, and I can use them again. So, we've met with the Chinese actors, they seemed have great interests in it. It's not 100% guaranteed, but it's looking good. And within a few weeks when the show I'm doing now is over, we'll meet and do rehearsals. Most of the Chinese actors I'm working with speak some English, some speaks very good English, one of them don't speak any at all. But...and my Chinese is basic. But I know the play, and I have my script, with Chinese on the side. I know what they're saying. I know the play upside down, backward; I know this play so well. So even if I don't know each Chinese word, I know the speeches they are saying, because I know this play so well.

其实推出《第十二夜》不是我的个人选择，也是基于市场等各方面原因的综合考量。《第十二夜》是一部很著名、很受欢迎的莎士比亚作品。我先后5次接触这个剧目，曾经担任过演员、也在七年前导过这部剧。所以我对它首先是非常熟悉的。我到中国来的最终目的就是要和中国的演员、用中文排一出戏。而之前我就一直想，如果我要在中国导一部莎士比亚的戏，那肯定是《第十二夜》。因为我对它熟悉、它需要的演员不多、又很受欢迎！所以也是巧合，在我这次执导《第十二夜》英文版的时候，我想时机到了。

所以我们和这些中国演员见了面，他们对此也很感兴趣。虽然我没有100%的把握，但看起来还是挺不错的。在英文版的《第十二夜》演出结束后，我们就将开始彩排。虽然大部分即将参与的中国演员不怎么讲英文、而我的中文也只有初级水平，但因为我对这部剧的熟悉程度，我相信还是可以处理的很好。

3. You don’t speak Chinese, and most actors and actress in the Chinese version do not have many experiences in acting, how do you plan to overcome these problems?

你不会中文，中文版的演员也大都没有特别多的演艺经验，如何克服这两点？

No they don't. A lot of them have some kind of performing experiences. There are some comedians, some poets...but actually I see this is a good thing, because it’s better to work with people who have no experiences than people who have bad habits. And the strongest challenge working with the English-speaking actors are that they all come from different backgrounds, they all have different ideas of how to do the work, they all have different vocabularies. I don’t think I’ve been 100% successful when getting them all pointed to the same direction. So when you work for people who are a blank slate, you can get them understand the way I work and the way I want them to work right from the beginning in a way, because everybody is talented, I believe that everybody has a talent, you know, so this is not a question of talent. I can get a good performance out of anybody if they listen to me and try to do what I ask them to do. So I think as long as they have the enthusiasm and good voices and attractive people, I think we'll be a very good show.

是的，我们大部分的中国演员没有什么话剧演出经验。但我反倒觉得这是好事儿，因为和没有经验的人工作、好过和有坏习惯的人工作。当时和英语的演员合作时，最大的挑战就是大家都来自不同的背景、有不同的想法、说不同的语言。我觉得在英语版中我不算是完全成功地把大家都融合到这部戏中来。

所以当你和没有什么经验的合作时，你可以让大家更清楚你希望这部戏发展成什么样。我相信每个人都是有天赋的，所以如果演员们愿意相信我、听我的话，那么我有能力将演员身上的潜力激发出来。只要他们对戏剧有热情、声音够好听、本身是有魅力的人，我们的中文版将会非常精彩。